BraveMen S4E153: Dr. Paul Endrei-Money for Church Growth

This is a special edition of the Brave Men Podcast on Paul Cole, and today you'll meet a friend of mine, Paul Andre, Dr. Paul Andre, who is the owner and founder of American Church Loans, and this is a special edition because we're going to be talking about getting loans for churches. Now, if you're interested in that at all, if you're involved in church life, buildings, and all of the things we need to be able to be missional in our community, then you know it's not easy to get financing. In fact, it's getting downright impossible. And Paul Andre found out that thing, and you'll hear it in the interview because he found out he just couldn't get it. They had equity, they had cash flow, they had everything couldn't get it. He developed his own company, his own business, had been an investor for years. He and his wife, Patty, have a marriage and relationship ministry called GLUE. And so there are authors, they travel, and they speak, I've been in one of their sessions, they're fantastic at that. And years ago in 1993, they founded a fantastic church in Cleveland, but he's given his whole life now to helping churches grow by getting the financing they need. In fact, I've got two friends, one of whom, if I'm not mistaken, they saved by the time he pulled it all together, they saved over $5,000 a month in their financing. And Anne was able to get it. So he's a, he's a solutions guy. That's what he does. In fact, Dr. Paul and I were on a, he's got some jet skis up there in Cleveland. And so we, we went out on Lake Erie. Is that Lake Erie right there? Yeah, it could be. I don't know. And so anyway, so we go out on the lake and on these jet skis and we're going to go to Cleveland. I don't know, which is like 18 miles away or something. So we take off and that's how he is. He's just an adventurous person. He's been an investor. He's been, he's a mountain bike rider. He just out there and get stuff done solutions guy. So we get halfway back and my jet ski just died. And he figured out a solution. And we towed that thing. I don't know, six miles or something. It was crazy. Got, got to the harbor just before dark. So made it in anyways, an amazing guy. He's an amazing guy. You're going to appreciate the expertise that he brings to the subject of getting financing to grow churches to help churches be missional in their community. And that is his focus. So thanks for being here today for this special edition of Brave Men. Make sure you get going here. Look at all the other podcasts we have. We have over 150 now. Fantastic, inspirational, strong on a myriad of different subjects from anxiety to politics to the NFL, all sorts of things. So it's something that'll brighten your day. And I've got one friend who talked to me. I ran into him. I say he's a friend because he listens to the podcast. So he's my friend. You'll know who you are when I mentioned it. I ran into him up in at Drew Davies Church up in Kirkland, Washington. And he said, Hey, man, you're my podcast guy. I said, Hey, thanks for thanks for being there. He says, yeah, he says I listen to it all the time. And I was like, man, I don't even listen to it all the time. But it was something his wife came up. She says, yeah, it really helps him center his life. So make sure you see and we got some great stuff coming up in the future. All kinds of guests that inspire us and teaching that builds us helps us become the man God designed us to be the man we desire to be. And the man our family and our community need us to be. Here's a special edition on financing churches and church buildings and growing churches on brave man. It's brave man with Paul Lewis Cole wisdom and courage for the journey. Talking with Dr Paul Andre and Dr Paul Andre, you've pastored in your background. You've been a business man. You have been an investor. You've done a lot of things. And through the series of events, you started American church loans. You churches and businesses. But you rescued some people from the brink. You and I were talking just a few moments ago about. About how many pastors and board members and how many of us are just in a chaos in our heart. I just think of guys who can't sleep a night. Yeah, here you are. And you've had the ability to learn it, work at it, figured out. And basically help rescue guys. What's been the experience with American church loans, Paul Andre? Well, I got to tell you the reason we started the business is because of our own pain and suffering. Many times this is what happens in people's lives. They go through a difficult trial and trauma. And they say, wow, God, how can help somebody else? And that's all we're doing is being able to offer the help assistance we had. But we were looking for a church loan. It was about seven, eight years ago. We went through almost a dozen lenders. And we kept hearing almost like an echo. Well, our bank doesn't want to do church loans because if we do, and we have to do a foreclosure, it's bad press. Oh, we don't want to do it. And that's not real. That's not real. It's not real. It's honestly, it's financial prejudice against the church. And it's very sad because they're not doing that against businesses, but the church is somehow got into this category of, hey, we don't want to do loans. And it's very, very consistent. So finally, we were able to get a loan. And as we went through this whole process, I thought to myself, you know, I've got over 20 loans doing real estate over the years, buying and selling properties and flipping and doing rentals and all this. And so I knew a lot about loans. And I thought, if I'm a pastorpreneur at the time, and I'm having difficulty, there is a lot of pastors out there that don't have that business background that are going to see this as a nightmare. So we launched American church loans a little over five years ago. Our first loan was a church in Canton, Ohio, $3.6 million. And they were so grateful we were able to save them a boatload of money in their refi and, you know, to tell you the truth, Dr. Paul, there's been numbers of situations where we literally have saved the church from going under. And I just, I think I'm one of them. I mean, I want you to give me an example of a minute, but I think one of the things we have to remember. Dr. Paul Andre, Dr. Paul Cole, Dr. Paul, I think one of the things we have to remember is culture is not lined up to assist the church. The culture we live in today is essentially aligned against the church, which is crazy to me because without the church, we lose our moral center, which culture just absolutely disintegrates. If it weren't for the church and local communities, you know, because here's the thing, everybody goes, yeah, I don't know about, you know, you're pushing your faith and you're doing this. Let a tornado happen. Where's everybody go? Right to the church. They're going to the church together, expecting the church to take care of everything. Exactly. And you know what the church says? We help. Right. I looked at a photo last night because when we're recording this, there were some the tragic tornadoes coming through Indiana, Mississippi, Arkansas. I saw a photo from a friend of mine of a long line of tables. And it's a church in Lou Rock and all of their members have taken time off of work, time out of school, and the packaging food. Throw it in vans and take it. I mean, this is the day. This is within 24 hours. Right. That's what the church does. That's why we need churches. We need churches because, you know, we've got to stem the moral tide. So you're American church loans is actually wrestling churches. So I wanted to jump in and just give my little two cents. That's fantastic. And it's a great thought because here's the reality. If you take out churches, you take out many hospitals, you take out universities. I mean, many of the prestigious universities in America were started by Christians. And I mean, it's definitely a foundation of this nation. And, you know, without churches continuing to exist and thrive society is going to hell in a hand basket. So we see our business really as a business slash ministry. We are about saving churches money so they can save more souls so they can add more staff so they can do more missions. You know, before we started American church loans, we planted 3,000 churches in Uganda. And it was a huge undertaking, almost 10 years, probably $100,000 very, very close to that. We had 12 people on staff in Uganda helping to organize the efforts and mobilize these pastors and the doing the ongoing training. So I understand it takes money to run a church. And why do we waste money paying high mortgage payments? And, you know, one of the things that I've noticed over the years that I travel out of been in all 12, I'm sorry, all 50 states. And every city that you go to, you see the biggest buildings in the city are banks and insurance companies. Just check it out, banks and insurance companies. So what we're doing by just paying these high mortgage payments is we're just building a bigger skyscraper for XYZ bank in our town. So tell me an example of recent. Well, there was there was the church actually one of our CNN churches that contacted me, you know, was there speaking at our conference recently and they asked me to look at their situation. It was not an easy situation. They had they were in a shopping center, which, you know, makes things a little more complicated than just a traditional church. And we looked at their situation, their bank basically did not want to continue with the relationship they didn't want to resign the note. And we were able to save them about $8,000 a month. So, you know, you can do the math. It's number one, eight thousand a month, pretty soon you're talking about real money, right? That's right. That's pretty real right there because every year at the hundred thousand dollars. And the wonderful thing is that a lot of banks have got churches on what I call financial treadmills. So they got these five year commercial loans. Sometimes they even make the pastors sign a personal guarantee, which we never do. We just absolutely afford that idea. I've heard that a number of times and how much stress that for a pastor he's already got a tough job. He's already got a tough job. Now he's got to worry like, okay, if the church has the down year and the bank note gets called, he's got to come up with the money. You know, it's just a real scary scenario. I just a couple years ago, there's a church in the Midwest pastor calls, he's in his sixties, he's getting ready to retire. He's on the note for the church and it was also about $3.6 million. So he says, can you help me? I said, absolutely, we can help you. We got him alone. It was around five percent, Dr. Paul. We got him alone at about three six. Now there's a couple years ago. And the rate was three six and we got him off that personal guarantee. He's sleeping at night and the church is doing way better financially. Yeah, and everybody, everybody wins. I'm talking with Dr. Paul Andre, who's the president and founder of American church loans. And that's American church loans.com. And you are an ally and a partner with Christian men's network and our dangerous nations, a campaign. You know, where we're going into some of the most difficult places in the world, establishing men's movement. Because if you change the heart of the man, you've touched us all of a nation. We start rescuing men. We rescue families. We've got a team right now that's in the Philippines. We've just had a team come back. Well, we got a team headed to Albania, which was close to the gospel for 50 years. And now we're going to train 60 pastors on the site of the men. They think about this, you know, if you trained 70 or 80 pastors in a training session, you've touched 800 men. So it would be, yeah, sometimes we want the big event. I just want the man of influence. And that's why churches are so important is the influence in a culture. And so thank you for being a part of the dangerous nations campaign, Paul. And what you got done in New York to it substantially. We love it. And I just want to say that you are a man's man. We know the number one need of a woman as a marriage author is safety and security. And there's no woman out there that's doing a dangerous nation's missions. This is proof of your manhood, my friends. Thank you. Thank you. Finally. At my age, I've hit proof of my manhood. I think you have hit it again. And I just wanted to say this real quickly because you brought this up. You know, we give a portion 10% of all of our commissions that we get through your referrals and see them in or anybody that mentions your name when they call us. 10% goes to your mission. And last year, that was over $5,000 as you know. And we just this month have decided, hey, we're going to do more than that. We're going to donate $100 a month. We're just going to make it part of our mission. To give and just so toward this ministry because really nobody else is doing it. And it's so vitally needed. Yeah, totally. Hey, so let me get back into this thing. American church loans.com. Thank you for the shout out on dangerous nations. American church loans.com. And then your phone numbers 440 454 2324. Yes. You know, it's funny though, when people do podcasts and they give out a phone number, it's like I'm working out on that. Yeah, I'm writing the number down, but that's what it is. Yeah, remember to write it down immediately. That's a great, great title. American church loans.com. I'm surprised it hadn't already been taken. I know it's crazy. I mean, it was, I wanted to have something that was national because we're in all 50 states. I wanted something that was real clear what type of loans that we focused on. We can do business loans, but we really are focused on churches because that's really our mission is helping pastors get provision for their mission. And, you know, we want them to be delivered from financial bondage. It's interesting. I mean, just to talk theology for a moment here, when God took the children of Israel out of Egypt, he took them through the Red Sea. Okay. There's a lot of churches that have been drowned in the Red Sea. The Lord has taken you out pastor and church board member. He wasn't ready, but right around to a promised land of blessings and abundance. Yeah, not only that, they took all the spoils from the Egyptians. So, you know, I think it takes people like yourself who are committed to it, who have learned the ins and outs. These forms, you know, you start filling out, they get, they can get, particularly for a church or a business because you help businesses also, right? Yes, we do. I'm happy to help anybody that, you know, needs a business long. We just, it's always going to be real estate collateral. That's, you know, no one's secured loans. Okay. So, it's always going to be real estate based. But in terms of churches and what our mission is, you know, when we get these issues with money around us, it just can grab our heart. It can get us depressed to the point where we don't go after some of the initiatives in our local community. We know we're supposed to go after. Yeah. Yeah. And if you have nothing, you can't give anything. So, I mean, you know, that's why Jesus says freely you have received, freely give. And what we want to do, you know, the end game of American church loans is to release millions and millions of dollars into ministry and into missions to be able to get the gospel out while we still have time. That's what we love about dangerous nations. I mean, Jesus made it clear, you know, the gospel must be preached into all nations, not just safe nations, but all nations. And then the end will come. I think you're a big part of that plan. Yeah. Now, money, when we start talking about money, people are like, you know, it's this money thing. You just talked about it a lot. I think I don't know what 25% of his parables were about money. You know, the word says where a man's heart is as money is as treasure is, but it doesn't say where man's treasure is as hard as his heart will be. Right. Yeah. And we've so money is incredibly important. And in particular, it represents our lives, our sweat, our toil, our effort, you know, and it also becomes and you guys you and your wife are marriage experts. And you've written books on a book called glue and you have a whole marriage thing that you've done. But that's that's one of the biggest issues that causes marriages to blow up. Is that right? Yeah. In the first five years, it's the number one. It's not number three or four. It's number one issue for marriage disolvenment. And you know, the thing is a lot of times couples, they immediately they want to have the same lifestyle standard of living as their parents had. So they use the plastic fantastic and they go out and they get deep into dead and then they can't, you know, make their payments and the frustration starts and the phone call starts. And you know, I just say do plastic surgery, baby. I mean, cut those cards up. You know, going to cash basis. Yeah. There is there is a place to use things, you know, for the you know, you pay it off handle. Yeah, there you go. Because compounding 25% man, that's a that's a killer number. So now, Patty, you and your wife, Patty have had experience with helping couples walk through these money issues. What's the first couple of things that you, I mean, plastic surgery is one of what's the first couple of things that you have? Well, I mean, number one, obviously, is the budget. You have to have a financial plan. You have to have a goal. And you know, Bible's real clear, you know, Jesus had a goal to go to Jerusalem to die. And as we look at good Friday coming up, you know, we realized that, you know, that was his focus. He had his face set on Jerusalem. So we have to have a goal of being able to not, you know, overspend and to get ourselves into debt. So this is what I say. I like the 1080 10 plan. This is what we teach couples. First 10% goes to God. When you honor God, God promises to open up the windows of heaven and pour a blessing on you. So even if you're in debt and even if you don't think you can afford to ties, you can't afford not to ties. That's where it starts. And that ties goes to your local church and then take that 80% and ask God for wisdom of how to spend it in the last 10%. And they say put it into savings and learn to be an investor because if you're getting 3% at the bank and somebody else is getting 12% through making better investments, you know, the compounding over the years is going to be F's astronomical. So be a saver and learn to invest. American church loans.com talking with Dr. Paul Andre, the founder, we've been talking about how money affects us as couples married. But man, I served as a, you know, I pastored was in business and then pastored and now stewarding the Christian and network. But I remember being on a church board and walking through our financial meetings and then we'd go at hours. You'd start a board meeting at 7 in the evening after a bag of work to have a quick salad together. He'd be there just going through this thing until 11 or 12 o'clock at night because the air conditioning on the West Wing broke down. How are we going to pay for it now? How are we going to do this and how are we going to do that and and all of a sudden there's no margin and then when on top of that when a bank calls and says, oh yeah, next year, we won't renew you. I mean, they call six or seven or eight months ahead of time and it seems like a lot of time, but in this money world, it's nothing. Well, you know, everybody knows about the banking crisis that we have, you know, through SVP and, you know, it's definitely a huge concern and I've had lenders tell me already. We are pulling back. We are more conservative in our approach and just recently I'm looking at a church in Delaware that they got noticed from their lender. We are calling your note. So I'm working diligently to get them alone and they don't have a lot of time because they're basically saying if you don't pay us, you know, we're going to foreclose on your church. And it's a big church hundreds and hundreds of people. Wow. And this is happening and this is happening in every state. Yes, it is. And in a lot of pastors, they're spiritually minded and they don't have, you know, the financial skill base, you know, they don't have much of a financial IQ. That's just call it that. And, you know, they don't even know, like, I mean, I was talking to a major, major national speaker. And, you know, we were talking about the church loan and he had no clue. He said, here, call my administrator. Oh, my God. No clue how much he owed. He had no clue what price he was paying. And, you know, when you're paying millions and millions of dollars, you got a multiple millions of dollars in debt and you don't have those kind of numbers that your fingertips are wrong. And we can do small loans as well. And for most of us as pastors, our calling was to help people preach to bind up wounds to get people hungry fed. And we get, you know, we just get focused on that. And then these money things come up. And the bank says, yeah, we're going to, because of everything is going on, your next deal is going to be it's a one and a half point increase. Right. I encourage you a two point fee on the front end. Well, if you're talking of four million dollar note, all of a sudden, here's an $80,000. Yeah, you got to come up with. And all of a sudden, every single month, you've popped up $2,500, which cuts out a staff member or cuts out the food bank money that you were putting into it or cut. You know, you know, and so those are real things that actually affect people. And now I'm telling you, in the whole banking world's change, Paul. Yes. I mean, in the last five years, I mean, I'm just telling pastors and church leaders out there today, check your note, see what you're paying. In most cases, we can save a church one to one and a half percent on what their local bank will do. So if they're paying, you know, five percent, you know, we're getting loans at four or three and a half. Now that we can't do that anymore. But I'm still able to get loans in the low five. That thing goes up and down and the fact that it's not going to get any better in the near run. So we just have to be smart about it. You know, I remember when I started my business, this goes back in the eighties, right? And just blew up real quick and all of a sudden, you know, I've got hundreds of thousands of dollars of receivables and tens of thousands of dollars of payroll. And I called Glenn Porterfield across the street at bank one day. Well, I actually went over to see him and I go, hey, Glenn, I've been banking here for a while, but I've never asked you about this. There's a occasion that I need, you know, some a little hit to make the way even though I know I got receivables coming in. He isn't no problem. Let's go fill this thing out. So we fill this little deal out. And he says, if you ever need something, just call me. Okay. So sure enough, there came a week where I called Glenn and I said, hey, man, I need 10,000 dollars. Okay. Now I was in the eighties, still a lot of money, but I was pretty free. Yeah. If I need 10 grand to make this and this work, I got a crew that's going to fly out and then I got to pay payroll Friday. He said, okay, I'll put it in your account right now. I said, all right. Wow. He's on an LC, right? And he goes, come over, you know, tomorrow or later today sometime and sign this little note thing. It's okay. So sure enough, you know, we paid it off two, three weeks later, a couple of payments, bam. That's it. Okay. So I don't know, three, four months later, there's another deal like that. I go, hey, Glenn, I need 20 grand on this deal. He goes, okay, I'll put it in right now. So that went on for a number of years. And then I remember one day, he called, he said, hey, we're being purchased. We're being bought by a bigger bank, right? New games. Yeah. So that, this is the late eighties, really nice. So that little phone call thing that we probably do. I can't do that. You know more. You can actually come over. And it's, and that's 30 years ago. And it's gotten worse and worse. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's like some of the things that that Judy and I've been doing personally or what we've been doing with the ministry recently. Right. You go back and forth and back and forth and back and forth and back and forth and like to those old days of calling Glenn across the street. Yeah. They're gone. Yeah. I think you're right. Here's something I really wanted to point out, Dr. Paul, is that we have over 20 church friendly lenders that we work with. Okay. So they are not going to call your note. Your local bank may get bought up by XYZ bank and they're, you know, they're going to say, hey, we're not doing church loans anymore. It happens every day. Yeah. But these are lenders. Some of them, you know, have 40% of their loans with churches and just a high percentage. And they have vice presidents of banks that are charge of lending, you know, in this particular arena. Credit unions. We have a bunch of credit unions that we work with. And most credit unions don't want to touch it. So I mean, we've found them. We've known who they are. I have great relationships with people. They're heads of these groups, portfolio managers and then foundations as well. So anyway, that's one of the things that I think it gives the past are a lot of safety. Say, hey, not only am I getting a great rate, but I'm not going to have to worry about having the rug pulled out from underneath me. Yeah, these are people who are in that world and they're committed to that. Thanks. Well, hey, I really, you know, you've got a depth of, you know, of teaching and ministry on marriages and money and all these things. But I, I just wanted to take this podcast. Thank you for letting me to stay in this focus because I really have this deep thing in my heart. I have such a heart. My heart breaks for guys who are not able to sleep. They're up late at night. They're discouraged. I depressed, you know, 40% of our pastors in America, according to most recent Pew reported, they can find a job that paid them the same that go get that job. Yeah, you know, and a lot of just surviving. Yeah. A lot of that Paul is related to the finances and a lot of that's related to they got an old note. They got something aboard member who's now not even a member of the church anymore. You know, has has a piece of this or this or that and it's just, you know, it just knots you up. You don't want to go in the office. You don't want to, you know, I mean, how do you sit and pray and prepare a message and. And minister to people and hug it, hug on people who are in the hospital or whatever it is. We're bound up in this financial bondage. Yeah, absolutely. You're right. And that's why we do what we do. And I just want to say something that I think, you know, everybody. You know, can do and that is we will be happy to do a free financial review for any pastor. Okay. If they go to our website, American church loans.com. It's right there on the very first page and just click a free financial review. It'll get sent directly to me that fill out some basic information. We'll we'll talk to them and we'll see. Hey, how we can help them if we can't help them. Well, at least advise them and hate, you know, in the future. This is what you want to do. If a pastor or church board members say, Hey, we want to get ready. We know our notes going to be due next year. This is the time to talk and get prepared because the reality is a lot of times. People are not ready for their loans and they need to have that loan. And so I tell people there's three pillars to a loan. Number one is cash flow and you want to make sure you have as much positive cash flow as possible. Number two is savings. And the more that you have in savings, the more attractive you are to the bank and the lower rates you're going to get. You have at least one to three months of savings based on your annual income. So if you have income of 600,000, you need at least 50,000 in savings. And the last thing is equity. You got to have equity before you can get a loan. So you've got a four-step loan process of it is pulled up your American church. And by the way, good looking site there, bro. Well, thank you. I appreciate that's a big compliment from you. But four-step loan process, applying out contact us, facts, success stories. I can see here you've got this thing free consultation. Man, it's, and you've got some great people you're working with. You've got consultants and people that help you with this stuff. So the four pillars, it's really clear, really clear. And so that's a lot of hard work right there, man. And I think two people that may want to referral that knows the MN. They could talk to Pastor David, Amber or Walt Landers. People that have got the loans and they can attest to the fact that we don't quit. Sometimes we have to go to two or three lenders, but we keep going until we get the loan. And I'm looking here, you've got some success stories where guys actually run on camera and talk about it. Yeah. Right. You know, they're not anonymous success stories. Yeah. The real people, real stories. And, you know, the one guy he's not on there, I mean, because I think his church people would probably freak out. But Pastor and Tampa, Florida, he had this terrible church bond deal. Oh, it's way, way bad deal. And he literally was getting four clothes down and we were able to save the church. 600 people were going to lose their building, lose their church. And we were able to save them over $7,000 a month in their payments. So they're doing tremendous. Top of keeping the church. And top of keeping the church. Everybody's happy. Well, it's been great talking to you. I do want to close this time and prayer. I do sense it. If you've stayed with us for this entire 30 minutes or so, as we've talked about. About really important things about salvaging churches and keeping churches alive and powerful within the local community. And the body of Christ, doing what we're called to do, which is, you know, helping people heal and bringing peace. And doing the things we do with whether it be a high school or a local food program. You know, churches are the center of the fabric of a growing and healthy and bolson culture. And so I just want to pray, Dr. Paul Andre has been with us today on this special edition of Brave Men. American church loans.com American church loans.com. And if you've stayed with us this whole time, I want to pray for you right now. And have Dr. Paul pray. And I trust the Holy Spirit. I trust myself. I trust the Holy Spirit right now to touch your heart. Bring us some wisdom. Father in the name of Jesus, James one five. You need wisdom. You said pray for it. You'd give it to us without reproach. So father is there's no shame in having made a mistake. Having not known what to do. But father, there are repercussions. And I ask you Lord right now in the name of Jesus to help my brother who's dealing with money issues. I pray healing over him. I pray wisdom. I pray strategy the next step. I pray father in this navigation in particular of a local church that's dealing with funding even a brand new building, whatever it is they're trying to do. Father, I pray right now that you would intervene as Dr. Paul can help Lord. I pray you'd give him a great insight and the ability to do it. And I pray blessing on American church loans. And they're family and everyone involved Mike and everyone involved with American church loans. Father, you would bless them. You would build this business. Lord, help us. I pray in the name of Jesus and help them to rescue dozens and dozens of churches that are in difficult places. And to calm the heart and bring peace to so many pastors. Dr. Paul, would you pray a blessing on our friends? Absolutely. Father, we just thank you that you want us to be blessed. Lord, it's your desire that we would prosper. And God, I pray that you would give men wisdom from your word. Wisdom is the principal thing. Father, that they might be able to have not just enough but more than enough to be able to meet the needs in their families as well as in their churches in their communities. And Father, we just know that wisdom comes from above. We don't want the wisdom of the earth. We want the wisdom from heaven. And Lord, we just pray for debt destruction, increase of income. Thank you, Father, for men just receiving opportunities for multiple streams of income. Lord, I just totally am a wholehearted believer in this. We should not just be completely bound by one stream. But Father, I thank you for opening up different streams. Unstop the wells, Lord, and bring a blessing to your kingdom. And specifically to C.M.N. Thank you, Lord, that C.M.N. is equipping men. God to be brave and strong and courageous in these last days. And Father, bring the great commission in front of all of us, Lord. Let it be our focal point. As we know, the great commission is our mission in Jesus' name. Amen. And amen. I got a final thought for you. Yeah. If you're a man, and you've made a mistake in your finances, you know what that makes you? Over 12. Yeah. If you go over 12 years old. Welcome to the club. Welcome to the club. Oh, man. You know, one of the things that you do learn is you get older. Try to make decisions based on other people's mistakes. He's right. I don't know. I don't know. It's not really the school you want to attend. That's someone else's school of hard knocks. Yeah. Anyway, Dr. Paul Andre, AmericanTursellums.com. Thanks for being on Brave Nade. All right. Love you. Thank you. Yes. You just experienced Brave Man with Paul Lewis Cole. Paul is president of the Christian Men's Network. Connect with Paul at cmn.man. Or write to him at Paul at cmn.man.