BraveMen S4E109: John Arana - Immaturity

It's Brave Men with Paul Lewis Cole, wisdom and courage for the journey. Hi, I'm Paul Lewis Cole, and with me is Pastor John Arana from Oasis Church in Arlington, Texas. This is the Brave Men podcast. Our series called Fifteen Go, which hasn't started yet. We're going to do it in a couple minutes. I'll hit start. As soon as we do a little talk thing. You can't count that. You know, it's like my friend Jean, a millstone, you know, Jean, he just had a lot of cars because he was buying real cheap cars when he was a kid. They didn't have any money, and so he just had the same kind of mindset. And so he'd buy a $200 car or whatever. And so one time Niles, my son-in-law said, so Jean, you've had 18 cars since I've known you. And Jean said, well, you can't count the brown one. Why? It never ran. But he bought it. Maybe that reflects what we're going to talk about today on Fifteen Go, which is maturity. And Jean, to his credit, when he did mature. And he had to deal with some things that the enemy had put in his life, self-thinking, bad self-talk. When that shifted and changed, and he started making mature decisions. Not only did he end up with a decent car, but he ended up with an awesome wife. A fantastic job. He ended up with the number one salesman in his company, a triple A. So when we talk about maturity, talking about your life growing to a place where you're making right choice. So, yeah, C-M-N dot men, Christian men's network, C-M-N dot men, which you'll find there on our website, our tools to help your life grow, to help you mentor others towards our growth. And tools to help you live a better life as a man. We're all about and focused on building strong men. Because strong men make strong families and strong families make strong churches. And that's why I love being with you, John, on these special podcasts. Because you're a pastor, you're a church planter, but you've traveled, taught leadership, you're an entrepreneur, your family's the same way, and I've been the same way in my life. And we sort of connect on that, planting church. We love the local church, and that's what Christian men's network is all about, is the local church. So, maturity, I'm going to hit ghosts, there goes our 15 go. Okay, here we go. And let me start with this, maturity. And we're talking about maturity versus immaturity. Yeah, right? I think, or how to be a mature? Sure. You know what? Or guys we know that aren't? Yeah. Are we going to use names? A little bit of everything. Here's a stat that I saw recently that just hit me hard about this whole thing. Was the average age of maturity in the U.S. now they're saying a man is finding his self at around the age of 30. Okay. Years ago it was 17 or 18. We would go to college in order to work on what we already looked at as our purpose. Right. But here's the key. Here's the key stat. 30. You're saying 30? That's 30. Check this one out. Wow. The average age of a guy that plays video games, a gamer. Yeah. Okay. The average age. When you think of a video gamer, what do you think of? A guy who plays video games. I think of a young kid. Yeah, a young guy. Playing, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Xbox. Yeah. You know, PS1, whatever. The Switch, whatever. Yeah, the whole deal. Yeah. So the average age of a gamer in the United States right now is 34. What? 34. Oh, wait. Okay. Okay. Here's the deal. You know why? Video game industry is five times, six times larger than the movie industry. Almost some years eight times larger than the movie industry. But it's owned by a lot of the same people. It's billions and billions of dollars, like 48 billion dollars. Oh my gosh. Okay. In the video game. Now think about it. The money's not made when you purchase the game. The money's made when you buy things within the game. Hmm. Okay. You buy armor, you buy a new level, you buy a new position. Okay. Okay. Who can afford that? 16-year-old? 14-year-old? Yeah. Yeah. That's the day. 34-year-old guy. Wow. Okay. Okay. So the reason then that the movie industry is making movies. Yeah. Okay. Check this out. The reason that movie industry is making movies like hangover and all kinds of movies like that. Right. Is to give permission to the 30-somethings to stay young or immature so that they can make money off of it. Right. While they plan their video games. Okay. So check it out. So the fact is what the world doesn't do is help a man become mature. Yeah. Okay. Until it's crunch time. And it's like, dude, why do you do that? Right. I don't know. Crysis. Crysis. Yeah. Crysis comes in. Yeah. So what's maturity, John? Pastor John? Well, I think, you know, for me, I learned from Dr. Cole that maturity is accepting responsibility. Doesn't necessarily come with age, but it's accepting responsibility. So it doesn't happen if you get older? No. And I've seen that bear true in so many men that I've mentored, you know, no matter what the age is. I mean, there's some young guys that get it in the starting to accept them responsibility for things. And I think those guys, you see the fruit. You see how their lives change. I wrote that down. Yeah. You see how their lives change, their marriages change, their relationship with their kids flourish, their businesses flourish, and you're going like, wow, it's because the guy accepted responsibility. Maternity decisions, to me, and that's what we teach. Maternity is the acceptance of responsibility. It doesn't come with age. Comes with that. Exactly. And so maturity, then, is making the right choice even when the emotions or context of the moment would cause you to do something else. That's right. So it's making the right decision. Yeah. It's purchasing the right thing or it's calling the right person or it's frankly when nobody's around. Yeah. Right? That's the character of your life that makes a mature decision. That's right. Even when nobody's looking. That's right. That's maturity. That's mature. And it produces in your life fruit. Yeah. Exactly. I think, you know, the scripture says, I want to read a few scriptures just says, having the Bible on this would be good. Yeah. That's why you're here, man. See, I'm going to be, I'm going to be just the guy. Just a guy. Paul. I'm going to be the Christian. You're the Christian. Yeah. Here we go. Here we go. It says, the Apostle Paul said, my little children, for whom I laver and birth again until Christ is formed in you. And then Jesus said, so formation, it's about formation. Christ is formed in you. So maturity is about formation, evolving and changing. But the change is about accepting. So it's becoming mature. Yeah. We know it's just arrived. No. It's a process. Dude, I'm telling you, man, I've been married a long time. Yeah. And I look back at my first few years, I'm like, and we'll laugh about it. Thank God she can laugh about it. To me too. Same here. Same here. Really? Did you? Did I really do that? I remember my wife telling me, but you never helped me. You never helped me. Why am I doing everything in this house, you know? And you said, what are we talking about? Yeah. I mean, what is it that you need? I don't know what you need. Just tell me what you need. Just tell me what you need. Just tell me what you need. Just tell me what you need. Yeah. Here's a deal for, if there, you know, guys need to tell their wives, listen, I don't get hints. Yeah. I don't get hints. I don't remind. Yeah. I don't remind them. I don't get hints. Just tell me. Because she would say to me, yeah, but you should know. You should know. You should know. But we don't know. And I'm like, I don't know why, because we've never been mentored. Exactly. Fatherless. I have no idea. When we talk about maturity and immaturity, I think the biggest, when we talk about fruit, and I want you to get into that next scripture too, because it hits that. When we talk about these things, I would say the most obvious, what was it, the situation, the most obvious result of immaturity that I could point to in our world today is fatherlessness. Yeah. You ready? Absolutely. And it's the number one issue. That's good. Yeah. Right? That's good. It's the number one issue. It's the leading indicator of poverty in every culture of the world. And poverty is always the leading indicator of children who don't do well in school. That's it. Yeah. It's called the Thinning of the Cortex. It was a study done by Harvard about five years ago. In which because of poverty and because of malnourishment. And we've got somewhere in a neighborhood of 18 million children in the United States are malnourished. And I don't mean they don't necessarily have something, not have something to eat at night. Yeah. But what they have doesn't actually build nutrition. They don't nutrition. Exactly. They don't nutrition. It's just something to make them, their stomach feel better. Right. Right. And so, for me, when we talk about maturity, bro, you're pushed towards maturity. Impacts and affects so many other people. Yeah. Because you're immature decisions. Impact so many people. It affects everyone around you. Yeah. Absolutely. So when we talk about that, we're talking about the formation of Christ and the fruit of your life. Yeah. And the scripture here, I like it because it talks about bearing the fruit. It says, Jesus said, I am the vine and you are the branches. And he who abides in me and I in him bears much fruit. And if you don't fall without me, you can do nothing. In other words, Jesus is just simply referring to a relationship. You know, hey, we're connected. And if you're connected, so this goes to the spiritual growth of the individual, of the man. And I think that spiritual growth precedes everything else. If I'm growing spiritually, then I'm going to treat my wife with love and kindness and respect. If I'm growing spiritually, then in some ways, I don't even have to tell you, right? I could help you, if I'm mentoring you, I could help you just grow your character. Yeah. Grow yourself. What is it? Understanding who Christ is in you. Colossians 17. There you go. They go. Christ is a century real life. Sure. And if I help you do that, it's going to affect everything else in your life. Absolutely. Because the Holy Spirit, I mean, Jesus said, I'm going to send you. Somebody who's going to lead you into the paths of wisdom, which is maturity. He's going to help the Holy Spirit. Exactly. Yeah. So it's going to help me make decisions in my business, but it's also probably going to check me when I start jacking up my relationship with my wife, exactly, and not helping. And sometimes what your wife has to be the Holy Spirit. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Well, you know, I see a lot of young guys that, again, mean well. You know, they get married and they have good intentions. You know, it's not that they're evil or anything. And then they start having kids and by houses and everything. But then they don't want to help around the house. They never, they don't want to spend some time with the kids. They don't want to cut the lawn, you know, and it's kind of like, hey, dude, man, come on. Wait a minute. You know, you have all these re-sponsors. You know what? There's, there's a word in Farsi and we just finished the Farsi translation of Maximized Manhood for Christian and his network. And you know, it's our Dangerous Nations campaign. Yeah. And so I'm excited about that. Now they have a word in Farsi that my friend Hormos taught me and it's Mard Bosch. Mard Bosch. What is that? And it just means, be a man, be a man, as if it's understood. Okay. Yes. If it's understood, be a man. Come on. That's what you're supposed to be. Don't be a baby. Don't be childish. Oh, that's good. That's good. Childishness. Yeah. We'll call it that. Right. But a child, a childish man, he's the center of his own universe. Just like a baby. Yeah. Baby, a baby doesn't care about what happens to other people, a baby doesn't care about unintended consequences. Exactly. Galatians 5, you were talking from Galatians 4 about the fruit of a man's life. Right. And then Galatians 5, he continues talking about this Paul the Apostle who wrote to a church in Galatia. And I love Galatians because in it, he had to instruct them about certain things. Yeah. Like, hey, when you're having communion, don't get drunk. Yes. Like the church of Corinth, he had to tell him, hey, it's not good for a guy to marry his mom. Right. Right. Imagine. Imagine. Imagine. The stuff that was going on, I mean, you know, so anyway. No, but it's like, you know, people didn't know. Yeah. Exactly. So that's why we have, that's what the New Testament is about. It's about the life of Christ. Yeah. And then it's some guys who helped us discover that. And he said the behavior of an immature man is obvious. Sexual immorality, lustful thoughts, pornography chasing after things and things instead of God. There you go. That's like stuff is more important than your relationship with others or God, manipulating others. Hatred of those who get in your way, census arguments, resentment. When others are favored, temper tantrums, dude, now that sounds like a baby right there. You know, how many guys is, how many men, you know, I'm talking about, you watch them at whether it's athletes or in business or whatever it is, who instead of just sitting down and going, okay, let me get this straight. Instead of just dealing with the issue, they have a temper tantrum. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, they slammed the back door, walked out of the house. Just like a baby, just like a baby, not that I ever did that. But that's when you know, dude, I'm acting like a baby. Yeah. Exactly. I'm just being a little punk right now. Yeah. I remember when we first got married, again, you know, I had a lot to learn, you know, nobody, nobody taught me much. But I remember we had our first argument and I remember this little apartment we lived in California. It wasn't big enough. Yeah. I was going to, I was still finishing my degrees in college and I got so mad, man, I don't know what we were talking about, but I got so mad that I hit the wall and I hit the wall from the kitchen and my fist went right through the wall and I can see the bathroom from the kitchen because I put a hole in both dudes. There's three things about that. Number one, that's pretty impressive. Frankly, it's pretty impressive. Number two, all right, that's some like cheap little apartment. Yeah. Exactly. Right. Yeah. So apologize on that one. Oh, big time. Big time, of course, which is part of being a mature man, but you're talking about being childless, you know, throwing a tantrum. That's what I did. A mature man. Yeah. Ask for forgiveness. Yeah. Absolutely. A mature man. Repents. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Being a man who's mature isn't talking about, and doing the right thing, isn't talking about being less masculine. No. It's about being more masculine. That's right. It's about being a real man. Being a follower of Christ is not about being a was. That's right. It's about being strong from the inside out, not just from the outside in. Yeah. And I think maturity for me is reflected in my love for other people, you know, my love for my wife, my love for my children, grandchildren, friends. And when you love someone, again, we learned this from Dr. Cole, you're willing to act in a way that's going to benefit them, even at your own cost, even at your own price, you know, and that is a strong man right there. Yeah. The strength is really from the inside out. Stronger man is on the inside, the more gentle he can be on the outside. That's right. The stronger man is on the inside, the more mature he is, making the right choices, accepting responsibility. Exactly. Then the outside, in his sense, John, it takes care of itself. Yeah. That's why I say your relational life is always a reflection of your spiritual life. Wow. You know, if your marriage is not well, it is, I guarantee you your spirituality is not well. You need to check on something there. And if you're growing spiritually and maturing, you know, then your need for counseling in your marriage gets reduced to hardly nothing. Wow. Because you're bearing those fruit as you mature, as you grow and accept responsibility. So if I'm married and I'm becoming more of a mature man, I begin to realize it's not always her fault. Is that right? Is that what it is? And actually, you begin to realize that most of the time it's your fault. Dude, I'm telling you, one of the things, and the clock just went off. We're done with 15. But one of the things I've discovered in my life is basically almost every poor decision that's been made in my life. There's one constant I've been there. There's a common denominator, which is I'm in the proximity. You're in the picture. That's right. A very bad decision. That's been made in my life. Hey, I've been talking with Pastor John Arana. It's Oasis Church. What's your website? www.oasisdfw.org. Oasisdfw.org. So, and that's Pastor John Arana, and you guys, you guys do Spanish and English services, right? We have an English service at 10 in the morning on Sunday in a Spanish service at 1 o'clock in the afternoon on Sunday. So, you can either go to the English service or go to the service that speaks the language of heaven. Yeah. There you go. And so, Pastor John Arana, and you're also on our, on our outreaches and ministry stuff with Dangerous Nations Campaign, and on that board that's reaching the nations with Christmas Network, going to the 50 most dangerous nations in the world, bringing the gospel, getting translations done. We've just got farcey done. We're working on Northern India, where dozens of Christians are being killed every week. Northern Nigeria, Johnny Moore is very active in there. We've just did a podcast with him and our long form podcast that's a remarkable interview. Wow. So, anyways, so John, thanks for being a part of that, and thanks for being my brother. Yeah. On Paul Cole, this is the Brave Men podcast, Christian Men's Network, CNN.man, helping men have a better life, build a better life, I guess is a better way to say it. We're going to work on that, Chris. Chris is our producer of our podcast. Helping men build a better life, something like that, like that kind of whole phrasing. Psalm 133 has been alive in my heart for the last few weeks, really, since my friend Rob Carmen passed away, in particular, and the last person that ends with this, hope now, hope always. So, I'd say that to you, brother, today, hope now, hope always. We'll see you next time in the Brave Men podcast. You've just experienced Brave Men with Paul Lewis Cole. Paul is president of the Christian Men's Network, connect with Paul at CNN.man, or write to him at Paul at CNN.man.